168 | What Makes Podgagement Essential for Indie Podcasters? Daniel J. Lewis Explains

[00:00:00] I don't know if there's a single podcast out there right now that does not like looking at

[00:00:06] all of the reviews and stats and data and positive feedback about their own show. What if there was

[00:00:14] a place that curated all of that good data, all that goodness about your show and presents

[00:00:21] you in a nice little package? Well, now there is.

[00:00:31] Sound Matters. Be heard. Welcome to the podcast where you get exclusive behind the scenes

[00:00:37] tips to make your own show sound truly spectacular. This is Podtastic Audio.

[00:00:46] What's happening? How are you doing today? Thank you so much for being here. I'm Chris and

[00:00:54] this is Podtastic Audio. These show which I've designed and created to help you,

[00:01:01] yes, you and other podcasters just like you make an amazing show for your audience. And that

[00:01:08] is what it's all about. You create the awesomeness. You create your amazing podcast

[00:01:13] and then you distribute it out to your listening audience and everybody's happy. It's a big

[00:01:19] night when when for everybody. But how do you know whether or not your audience that listens to

[00:01:25] your show really truly enjoys your show? Well, one would say that possibly they could leave a

[00:01:32] rating or review and honest rating a review not a fake one but actual true honest one.

[00:01:39] But where do you leave it? Do you leave it on Apple podcast or do you leave it on Spotify or

[00:01:45] on podchaser or on good pods or on fill in the blank? All the different ones. I'm sure there's

[00:01:51] a bunch out there. I don't know about but what if there was an easy like really easy place to

[00:01:56] track all this data and put it in front of you in a nice, easy, easy look at package that

[00:02:02] looks great for maybe your website or to share on social media like check all my reviews and

[00:02:08] cool stuff. Check all this out like a media kit that's created for you based on your podcast.

[00:02:16] Well, there is. Welcome to podgeagement. Now, podgeagement is a platform that allows you

[00:02:24] to take your podcast and have it curate all of these fantastic reviews and all this stuff

[00:02:31] and package it all for you right there in one easy place. Make it easy for you to actually

[00:02:37] just do what you do best is creating amazing content and don't worry about tracking down

[00:02:43] reviews or tracking down where all this stuff is or putting everything together. So to make sense

[00:02:48] of all this stuff, I've invited Daniel J. Lewis on the show today, the creator of podgeagement.

[00:02:55] We're going to talk all about podcasting what it means to be an indie podcaster like most of us are.

[00:03:01] This whole new thing of podcasting 2.0, what is it? Is it even worth its time?

[00:03:06] And of course, talking all about podgeagement and how it can help you better your podcast

[00:03:13] and make sure that you are doing the right thing when it comes to delivering the amazing content

[00:03:18] for your audience. Daniel J. Lewis, the legendary Daniel J. Lewis. Now I believe you are a

[00:03:25] whole of famer in the podcasting community is that right? Yes, that's it's a huge honor to be that

[00:03:30] and also our huge honor to be talking with you too Chris. We've interacted through x Twitter for

[00:03:35] months and to actually get to talk voice to voice is great. This is great man. This is fantastic.

[00:03:40] I know I first discovered your podcast probably along the way a lot of other podcasters have also

[00:03:46] discovered your podcast was because when I first started in podcasting, I used audacity and I was like

[00:03:54] well maybe there's a podcast about audacity and then he plugged those two things into your search

[00:03:59] field and audacity your show comes up. And that's how I listened to I think it was one of

[00:04:05] your episodes or the two part episode you did, I think it was like on how to podcast or something

[00:04:10] like that, I'm going to when you recorded that, I when you released it. I remember that was like

[00:04:14] a first time I've ever listened to you. Yeah, I worked hard on that SEO aspect of the title. I always

[00:04:22] wanted the title to have that double meaning that I wanted the SEO benefit for anyone looking

[00:04:28] for how to podcast with audacity. So the title, the audacity to podcast helps rank well with that

[00:04:35] search. But also the title has always really had the meaning of the guts, the courage,

[00:04:41] the power to podcast. So I like having that double meaning it keeps me out of trademark trouble as well.

[00:04:47] And it really lays the foundation for the future of what I'm most passionate about in podcasting.

[00:04:54] So what did you first get started with? That was your first podcast, wasn't it? No. I started

[00:05:00] listening to podcasts in 05 when iTunes 4.9 came out with support for podcasts. That was my first

[00:05:07] introduction to what a podcast even is and I was immediately hurt because I had a long commute.

[00:05:14] I was tired of what was on popular, terrestrial radio and I love the world of podcasts where

[00:05:20] anyone could talk about anything and their podcast could be about only that one subject.

[00:05:27] And that just had me hooked because I didn't like always hearing sports and local news

[00:05:32] and financial talk or the typical things you hear on terrestrial radio. So right from that start,

[00:05:38] as soon as I started listening, I thought, I could do this. I could have my podcast. I want to

[00:05:45] have a podcast someday too and I was thinking back then, I really like making people laugh.

[00:05:51] I'd like to have a comedy podcast and make people laugh through comedy because I was a

[00:05:55] bachelor then and again now. And there were a lot of funny things that happened in my life

[00:06:01] being a bachelor and out on my own for the first time and all of that. But it took me two years

[00:06:07] to actually launch my podcast because I had all of these ideas in my mind. I was obsessed with

[00:06:13] perfection. I wasn't quite sure how I wanted to do it and it was finally just showing from a

[00:06:19] couple of people at the same time who basically said the same thing just start. And so I did.

[00:06:28] I still struggled with perfection for a couple of years after that too, but just finally starting

[00:06:33] so it was in 07 that I launched my first podcast, which was a clean comedy podcast called The

[00:06:39] Nudes. Nice. Why that name? Well, because I was a bachelor and the comedy thing which actually

[00:06:47] is ramen noodles. Yeah. It's like that back in cheese. Oh yeah. And originally the podcast was

[00:06:53] actually called Bachelorette Chronicles but that didn't quite communicate the comedy aspect of it

[00:06:59] and also communicated some other things I didn't intend. But I always knew that I wanted ramen

[00:07:04] somehow part of the branding because that's such a signature thing of bachelor's. And sorry,

[00:07:10] started thinking like will work for ramen noodles or ramen comedy and then I just had this thought

[00:07:15] of hey what if my identity is I am the ramen noodle and that be the name of the podcast is

[00:07:24] the ramen noodle like that's a title for a person or it is a person itself and that's how it

[00:07:31] came about and it carried that name through all of the years I did that podcast until I retired.

[00:07:36] Nice. So when you first started it, iTunes they introduced the podcast in the iTunes

[00:07:42] store at that point, right? Yeah. iTunes had already been around with support for podcast

[00:07:47] for about two years at that point. Now that was what the point I think that most people,

[00:07:52] most regular people probably got introduced to some kind of a podcast. Yes. And that's probably

[00:07:57] when Apple or somebody coined the name podcast from iPod I'm assuming but I don't know that's

[00:08:02] quite clear. Can you make the determination one or not that was actually the point where iPod,

[00:08:07] what podcast came from? There's some different information on it but really it was back in 2004

[00:08:14] when it was called podcasting and a podcast and that is the the portment toe of iPod because

[00:08:23] back then that's where people were using to listen to these things and that was the most popular

[00:08:27] portable media player at that time. This was before the iPhone we have to remember that. So it was

[00:08:32] iPod and a broad cast so you put those together, you get podcast and that name has stuck.

[00:08:39] Some people even tried to change the name to things like webcast and netcast because at some point

[00:08:44] there was a concern that Apple might go after people for trademark infringement because it borrowed

[00:08:50] from iPod but at some point that was released because Apple clearly said no we are not claiming

[00:08:57] trademark over the term podcast and so it's been called a podcast to this day and now some

[00:09:03] people are trying to redefine what a podcast is. He imagined if Apple like claimed the name

[00:09:09] podcast it was like only their brand name or that'd be like today would it be like everybody had

[00:09:14] used an iPod and I and iPhone to listen to it to a podcast? Well that was the problem back then

[00:09:20] is people would hear pod in podcast and they would think oh I don't have an iPod I can't listen to a

[00:09:26] podcast and it's funny how now that's not even a concern. People don't even think about iPods

[00:09:32] anymore or even have an iPod they just hear the word podcast and they don't even think

[00:09:37] oh I need a particular device for that and how we're battling against different false impressions

[00:09:43] but it's fascinating how that has changed over the years.

[00:09:48] So what do you think of like the biggest challenge for maybe an iPodcaster because the

[00:09:54] industry is growing up so much since those days in 2007 there's so many big players in the

[00:09:59] game but how does an in-e podcast or today like how they stand out how they grow their show today?

[00:10:04] It's interesting that as an industry they often talk about there's a podcast discovery problem

[00:10:11] but I think that's both true and false because it really depends on which perspective you're

[00:10:18] looking at podjast discovery. Most of the people who say there's a podcast discovery problem are

[00:10:24] saying that because their podcast is not being discovered but the average audience member out there

[00:10:31] is not thinking if only there was a podcast I could discover there's no discovery problem to the

[00:10:38] audience the problem is for the podcaster and especially for the indie podcaster because the

[00:10:44] big name podcasts have huge marketing budgets that they can spend on these things. They've got

[00:10:51] huge reach and potential and connections in the industry with other people who have large

[00:10:55] followings and they can leverage all of those connections and all of that but we indies don't have

[00:11:02] the dollars we probably don't have the connections what we have is passion for niches and that's

[00:11:11] what I think indie podcasters need to embrace not trying to be the next Joe Rogan or the next

[00:11:18] serial podcast or the next whatever popular podcast is out there but embrace your niche. I think it was

[00:11:27] the way that Apple said it is something like here's to the weird ones or something like that.

[00:11:33] Originally in their whole branding for Apple was like where for the people who don't fit into

[00:11:38] other boxes or typical boxes where for the creative people, the creative types, the weird ones,

[00:11:43] embrace your weirdness in that aspect with your podcast of what makes you unique what makes

[00:11:49] your approach to this subject unique. Sometimes even simply that subject is unique because

[00:11:57] maybe no one else is doing a podcast about that there's a video game that I've been a fan of for

[00:12:02] a while and I've looked online and discovered that at one point there were no active podcasts

[00:12:11] about that specific game plenty of YouTube channels yes many of those YouTube channels could actually

[00:12:17] be podcasts because they weren't actually showing a good content often they were simply talking

[00:12:24] about content but those are opportunities if there's a movie franchise or a book franchise

[00:12:31] or a fan of you could make a podcast about that a lot of podcasters got their start on making

[00:12:39] TV show fan podcasts and that has huge potential even still because there are new TV shows

[00:12:46] and more and more people are familiar with the concept of their being after show podcasts for

[00:12:53] their favorite TV shows maybe just talking about the shows highlighting certain moments making fun

[00:12:59] of the shows even sometimes digging deep into the theories of the shows like with lost once upon a

[00:13:05] time fringe and other shows like that to have this deep lore and mystery to them and that kind

[00:13:12] of stuff that taps into people's weird sides they're nerdy geeky sides where they really get

[00:13:19] deep into something and as indie podcasters we can do that because we're not thinking about

[00:13:26] how I need to have an idea that will appeal to millions of people what we're often thinking about is

[00:13:33] I have an idea that will be fun and we'll connect me with other people who will have fun too.

[00:13:41] I talk about the idea of profit PROFIT and it's the ways that both you as the podcaster

[00:13:48] and your audience need to benefit from your podcast and PROFIT stands for popularity relationships,

[00:13:58] opportunities, un-income and tangibles and you can benefit any one of those ways from your podcast

[00:14:04] so it doesn't always have to be about money it could simply be the fun in it the fun you have

[00:14:11] and the fun that your community has. Yeah I think when you are an indie podcaster,

[00:14:15] it's a hobbyist podcast like most of us are here that fun is probably like the number one

[00:14:21] factor we even created a podcast it would be nice if we could pay to do this too but I think

[00:14:25] when you start focusing more on the monetization side of podcasting because sucks some of the

[00:14:31] fun out of it really makes me it can yeah because then you start thinking of your audience in terms

[00:14:37] of dollar amounts or pennies and really thinking I need a bigger audience so that I can make

[00:14:43] more money and then we start to lose focus instead of like I want a bigger audience so that

[00:14:48] I get more feedback or so that we can get more people having fun with this or so that I can impact

[00:14:54] more people for good with whatever your podcast however serves them and your vision for your podcast

[00:15:01] or any of that bringing on sponsors or focusing on the money then starts to it has to change

[00:15:07] that focus really because to make a profitable podcast you have to look at it as a business and when

[00:15:15] it's a business then you really have to think about the bottom line ultimately business is still

[00:15:20] needs to focus on how they serve their customer because otherwise there would be no business but

[00:15:26] they also have to think about the bottom line and as any podcasters you don't have to look at it that

[00:15:34] way it might someday become that but it doesn't have to be that like it does have to be for

[00:15:40] the big podcasters the NPRs and such. Right I think that any podcasters probably do work best

[00:15:46] if they narrow down to a particular niche or a particular subject matter something that they're

[00:15:52] passionate about that they know a lot about versus trying to be the next morning radio show.

[00:15:58] I know a lot of shows do that and I've got to guilty of that myself it's because when I first

[00:16:03] got into podcast I guess all like new like I knew of morning radio so I was like well I guess

[00:16:08] that's how podcasting is because I listened to a lot of like morning radio podcasts so I didn't

[00:16:15] listen to a lot of these deep niche filled podcasts it was more just like a broad general stuff

[00:16:21] like a Joe Rogan type of stuff and I know a lot of shows try to be just like Joe Rogan but

[00:16:25] there's some shows that even try to mimic the exact same stuff talking about the same stuff

[00:16:30] he's talking about they're thinking like why is it my show growing well first off you're not Joe Rogan

[00:16:35] yes right you know and secondly they've got massive budget to mean they've got also speaking of

[00:16:40] Joe Rogan like I would listen to Joe Rogan show if it was just Joe Rogan like he isn't half-to-have-agast

[00:16:47] and a lot of these podcasters will come on they'll do their show but there are interview only

[00:16:53] shows well those only do interview that's all they do while I'm talking interesting people

[00:16:57] but interesting things in blah blah blah whatever whatever now I told this to another podcast

[00:17:01] drunk friends the other day I'm gonna tell you right now because he mentioned this about

[00:17:04] doing so low shows versus doing interview shows and I said interview only podcasters

[00:17:10] probably gonna love hate for this but I say interview only podcasters it's a crutch

[00:17:15] it's a crutch for podcasters that have no talent mmm those are fighting words but I know

[00:17:22] they are right there is a lot of truth to that though yeah I mean there's well I did

[00:17:27] interview shows too on the Chris Christie and so we did a little ton of interviewers and

[00:17:29] I thought they were easy peasy I mean yeah you gotta ask them a few questions get the

[00:17:32] conversation rolling that kind of stuff but you let the guests do all the heavy lifting

[00:17:36] I mean you ask them a couple of questions but you get the guests do a lot of heavy lifting so

[00:17:41] it's so much harder to like create something from scratch all by yourself with no crutch,

[00:17:47] no guests to lean on, no co-host, lean on just you doing your thing for how long your episode is

[00:17:53] it's much harder to pull that off than to do an interview show said it meant it there you go

[00:17:58] and I think it really goes back to why do people want to do the interview show like you look at

[00:18:04] people who have successful interview based podcasts and the reason they do the interviews

[00:18:10] is because they are genuinely fascinated and curious about these stories from these people

[00:18:17] whatever their focus is on these things like you look at beyond the to-do list with Eric J. Fisher

[00:18:23] he used to be on a podcast network that I used to run and he wants to talk about productivity but not

[00:18:29] just productivity tools it's stuff beyond the to-do list as you can tell from the name it's like

[00:18:36] the mindset of productivity and he's fascinated with that and he's curious how other people are thinking

[00:18:43] that enables them to get things done and so that's what his podcast focuses on or you look at

[00:18:49] other podcasts the interview people around certain things because they're so curious and they're like

[00:18:55] I really want to talk to people about this I really want to highlight these stories around this

[00:19:01] thing John Lee Duma's also with entrepreneurs on fire or E.O. Fire he started that because he was thinking

[00:19:09] I really want to hear this information from a whole bunch of entrepreneurs I want these tidbits

[00:19:15] of inspiration this is what I want to hear and so he made that podcast that he wanted to hear

[00:19:24] and it turns out a lot of other people wanted to hear it too those are successful interview-based

[00:19:29] podcast some people though I think do look at it as a crutch they think I'm not so sure about doing

[00:19:37] a solo podcast so I know what I'll do I'll interview other people I'll just find interesting people

[00:19:44] and we'll talk about on a movies and stuff or what does what figure something out to talk about

[00:19:49] you ran up people yeah it's anybody with the pulse on the show it should be a podcast called

[00:19:55] eating with the pulse come on on come on the show that's the thing life that I'm on shows like

[00:20:02] that I was on a guest on a show once it was a show kind of like that I think and if you're

[00:20:07] every was horrible he never told me that episode got released I don't know this show might have

[00:20:10] pod faded for all you know but I could tell he's kind of nervous and then he was asking

[00:20:15] to list a questions and then he was asking me questions and then and then he went straight to

[00:20:20] the list of questions and he asked me a question he asked me like four questions ago oh yeah

[00:20:24] the same question you know word for word I'm like well I already answered that question

[00:20:27] like I'm gonna go but here you go again you know so but but you know I mean I see where a lot of

[00:20:32] people that they feel like they can't hold they're they got nothing important to say so I'm

[00:20:38] going to bring on somebody that does have something important to say because I myself isn't that

[00:20:42] my self isn't that knowledgeable in whatever the topic is so I will bring experts on they'll

[00:20:48] ask them some questions that you know get the ball rolling and we'll let them be the expert.

[00:20:54] The only problem with that is that if your show is trying to position you as the expert

[00:21:00] to get them son of figure coaching classes or whatever you're selling they you're not being

[00:21:05] care or even though you haven't had that stuff because you're positioning the guests as the

[00:21:09] right unless you're approached to the guest and this takes very intentional work on your

[00:21:16] part but if you're approached to the guest is a syllable skill then you can monetize that like

[00:21:22] Jordan Harbinger does with the Jordan Harbinger show and where he then he teaches people how to

[00:21:28] network how to build relationships and such like he is demonstrating in his podcast

[00:21:34] but he's done that with very intentional and designed skills in those areas.

[00:21:41] Right and I think a lot of indie podcasts was a jump on first time using a microphone

[00:21:45] we're gonna do a zoom show and interview whatever people and stuff and some people might

[00:21:51] have some skills from their daily job maybe they're you know HR and they're used to the hiring

[00:21:56] process your management or whatever things like that and that skills like that do transfer over

[00:22:00] but I mean some people that come into podcasting their regular job might be flipping burgers and

[00:22:05] McDonald's and they come in and they want to be an interview you know interview expert type of

[00:22:10] show and that's fine you can do whatever you want anybody can podcast but anything they want

[00:22:13] go right ahead you know have at it you know speaking of podcasts you know Daniels ask you

[00:22:18] what your thoughts on like having to have video for your podcast versus audio I mean is it as important

[00:22:24] as everybody keeps preaching about these days that goes to the question what is a podcast coming

[00:22:32] soon from Matt what but that is the big question right now is what really is a podcast and the

[00:22:39] we talked about earlier how people used to think oh I have to have an iPod to listen to that

[00:22:45] now some people are starting to think oh that's YouTube and much of the reason people are thinking

[00:22:51] that is because people on YouTube are calling their show as podcasts and so that is just starting to

[00:22:59] confuse people I think but here's the thing is we really the word podcast is really a label for

[00:23:10] a particular distribution method it is not a description of a type of show it some survey came out

[00:23:19] about a year ago or so that some people thought that what made a podcast is when you see people

[00:23:25] sitting around a table talking into microphones wearing headphones that is what a podcast is

[00:23:34] interesting that's like format that's not even format that's more like just how you are position

[00:23:41] physically positioned and what is in the shot that is not what makes a podcast or something else

[00:23:47] what I would love for as content creators to do is more just think of it as we make shows we make

[00:23:54] talk shows or drama shows or whatever these are shows and we distribute them in different ways

[00:24:01] like even someone who calls themselves a YouTuber I don't like that either because I think well

[00:24:07] if you call yourself a YouTuber what if you want to do something other than YouTube what if you

[00:24:13] want to put your show on Amazon Prime are you then a primer or what if you get bought

[00:24:19] all my Netflix are you a Netflixer or what are you are you are who the world you know

[00:24:26] don't tie your branding or your identity to the platforms or the tools you use or even to the

[00:24:33] distribution method now I think with podcasting though it is a little bit separate because of

[00:24:40] all of these other common methods of consuming media they are all tied to one specific platform

[00:24:49] YouTube videos you get from YouTube yes people can embed them on their websites but it's still

[00:24:55] a YouTube video yeah it looks like YouTube it doesn't look anywhere else and shows like

[00:25:00] stranger things it's a Netflix show it is only on Netflix and now Disney plus has certain

[00:25:06] Disney shows that are only on Disney plus and may never come to DVD or Blu-ray and that's

[00:25:13] disappointing but that's their new model now is entertainment as a service so each of these kinds

[00:25:19] of other shows are tied to one platform well podcasting is separate from that because with a podcast

[00:25:28] you can get a podcast whatever podcast you want pretty much in one of probably 200 apps or maybe

[00:25:38] even more at this point out there that you could use on dozens of different kinds of devices

[00:25:44] you could consume the same podcast through your iPhone and then listen to it or watch it through your

[00:25:51] TV or your smart speaker or with this latest version of WatchOS and the Apple Watch that was recently

[00:25:57] you could even listen to a podcast through your watch without your phone you could there are certain

[00:26:05] earbuds out there where you can upload audio to the earbud and listen to that audio whether it be

[00:26:11] a podcast music or an audiobook listen to that without any other devices with you only your earbuds

[00:26:17] so this is content that can be consumed almost anywhere through any device through hundreds of

[00:26:26] different apps and that is what's unique about podcasting speak of podcasting the new latest buzz

[00:26:34] word in the podcasting space has got to be this thing called podcasting 2.0 hey I'm still wondering

[00:26:39] what one point I know even was but now we're on a 2.0 can you explain what 2.0 is and like

[00:26:45] what kind of benefits does it happen to the half for the podcaster and the listener themselves

[00:26:51] yet really first comes back to technically what is a podcast and a podcast is

[00:26:59] downloadable media syndicated through an RSS feed at its simplest form that is technically what a podcast

[00:27:07] is and the reason I have to bring that up is that the RSS feed the technology that makes podcasting

[00:27:14] possible has had limitations for years and those limitations have more just been

[00:27:20] the result of one company Apple pretty much setting the standard for what other podcasts did

[00:27:27] and no one really innovating on that but RSS I have to get technical here RSS is a particular

[00:27:35] flavor of XML code XML stands for extensible markup language and it's that extensible part

[00:27:44] that means we can make RSS feeds do more than they currently do that's where podcasting 2.0

[00:27:52] comes along to extend what is possible through the technical distribution method of podcasting

[00:27:59] so that podcasting apps can start supporting new standards and these are features that really

[00:28:07] benefit everyone from all sides of podcasting it benefits the audiences the podcasters the developers

[00:28:16] both the app developers and the distribution developers and it can even benefit the advertisers so

[00:28:24] some of these features just to cherry pick a few of them in some of my favorites are like making an

[00:28:29] audio podcast more engaging for someone looking at their device making it so that they can see a

[00:28:36] sure that you're talking about in your audio podcast without having to give video making it so they

[00:28:41] can more easily review your notes making it so people can follow along in a transcript word by word

[00:28:49] as they're listening maybe for accessibility reasons or for retention or understanding reasons

[00:28:56] or to review something or certain automation tools that can come out of that it could also be

[00:29:02] stuff like comments and this is something that's still being developed but a way that your

[00:29:07] audience can engage with you back with you through their podcast app as well as engaging with

[00:29:14] other listeners who might be using different podcasting apps or podcast apps and ways that they

[00:29:22] can build community then and those relationships with other audience members all without leaving

[00:29:28] the podcast app that they're currently in and so these are the kinds of things that podcast

[00:29:33] team 2.0 is laying this technical foundation for so that these apps and development and publishing

[00:29:40] platforms can start supporting these features now when you send the comments in the chat now

[00:29:46] with this be able to do an kind of like a live stream podcasting and then chat live like that

[00:29:51] like YouTube does absolutely we already have a live tag which for podcasting 2.0 enabled apps

[00:30:00] like custommatic podcast guru true fans a few others out there what this could allow them to do is

[00:30:08] when you want to live stream your recording it's not technically live podcasting because of

[00:30:14] the whole technical definitions of things but if you want to call it live podcasting okay go ahead

[00:30:19] but you could then send out a little signal that then on people's devices inside their podcast apps

[00:30:26] it could say a potastic audio is going live tap here to listen right now and they tap it

[00:30:34] it's in their podcast app they start listening live to you and there might be even a chat room right

[00:30:40] there in their podcast app and that is your official chat room but being pulled into the podcasting

[00:30:47] so they're bringing all this engagement and interaction into the podcast app and that's what's

[00:30:54] so beautiful that people might not have to go visit a webpage to consume something or to engage

[00:31:01] but they can do it all right there inside their app because of what's being enabled with podcasting

[00:31:06] 2.0 it sounds like we kind of have some of this stuff already with Instagram live and things

[00:31:13] that sort so it's this kind of the same thing but you're talking about on a podcast app that

[00:31:19] could be distributed whatever podcast app you're on that supports podcast 2.0 of course

[00:31:24] where Instagram you have to be on Instagram and Instagram account for that to happen

[00:31:28] but it's kind of the same thing right yeah it's very close to it but the nice thing is like

[00:31:34] with Instagram you have to be on Instagram and that's your only option but with podcasting 2.0

[00:31:41] and how the distribution and consumption of podcasting is very decentralized someone could be

[00:31:49] on true fans which is a web app for podcasts and someone else could be in

[00:31:53] customatic but they can be engaging with each other and engaging at the same moment with

[00:31:59] the live podcast at the same time even though they are in different apps.

[00:32:05] It's fantastic now do you see this being more beneficial for audio podcasts or think video podcasts

[00:32:11] they wouldn't care?

[00:32:14] Well from a technical perspective video podcasts aren't very popular anymore because YouTube

[00:32:19] stole the video show a lot of people are trying to call YouTube stuff video podcasts but regardless

[00:32:24] of that debate over definitions and technical things there are ways that this can even tie in

[00:32:31] with video content whether that's video in true podcast form or video on YouTube because there

[00:32:38] new things that we're being able to do like an audio feed that can indicate

[00:32:43] that there is an alternative format of this same content and that alternative format is video.

[00:32:50] So someone could theoretically then be listening to the podcast and then decide,

[00:32:55] no I really want to watch the podcast so they tap a button to switch over to the video version

[00:33:01] and it jumps right to where they were listening and now they're suddenly seeing it

[00:33:06] downloading the video or streaming the video and then maybe they decide I want to go back to audio only

[00:33:11] so they switch back to the audio version it streams only the audio so it's not using up a lot of

[00:33:17] energy in it or bandwidth and they're able to switch back and forth because of what's possible

[00:33:22] inside the RSS feed through podcasting 2.0. And some of the things like we're recording right now

[00:33:28] through only audio I can't see you at all we're not even recording the video to publish video

[00:33:35] but maybe the live experience for someone could include video or maybe someone is publishing the

[00:33:41] video and they could then watch inside their podcast app watch live comment live and see things

[00:33:49] even if the podcast is usually only audio. It's got to take a lot of bandwidth pull it off right?

[00:33:56] Well some of these things are using bandwidth from certain other providers like some of the stuff

[00:34:02] that I'm advocating for is hey let's remember to support other tools like YouTube live and it is

[00:34:09] very possible to embed a YouTube video inside a podcast app so if you were doing YouTube live

[00:34:17] then you could very easily bring that live video even though it's distributed and streamed through

[00:34:22] YouTube you could bring that into the podcast app so then you're using YouTube's distribution bandwidth

[00:34:29] but whoever is consuming that on their device would be then consuming the bandwidth of a video

[00:34:35] and that's where they have to consider just like they were at any time they're watching a video

[00:34:40] or listening to audio they have to think about any kind of bandwidth restrictions that they may have

[00:34:46] but most people would probably be somewhere on Wi-Fi to be able to sit still and watch or listen

[00:34:55] yes there's some of the commuters who are maybe writing a bus or a train and that's where

[00:35:02] really the podcast format downloadable media is so great because you might not get a Wi-Fi signal

[00:35:09] in a train or on a plane not in a boat not on a goat not where it melts not in the house

[00:35:15] Dr. Zeus yeah so you might not get Wi-Fi in those places but you can take a pre-downloaded podcast

[00:35:22] into those places well it's like airplane too I'm not gonna call big flights to summer

[00:35:26] and they will download some movies to my tablet you know and of course they've got the Wi-Fi

[00:35:30] the plane for whatever selected content they have but yeah i think it's one thing except

[00:35:35] rates like an actual podcast you can download versus like a YouTube video i think you can download

[00:35:41] YouTube stuff but that's only on the premium package right I know yes so YouTube read right so

[00:35:48] that's kind of sucks with that I guess but yeah i mean i love podcasting live audio probably

[00:35:53] because i consume more of it i think it's also i notice in the podcast here is that they seem to

[00:35:58] create the thing they zoom the most so if they're consuming a lot of like video like YouTube and

[00:36:05] like oh yeah i guess YouTube and Netflix and all that kind of stuff i think they kind of

[00:36:09] start to lean towards the video style show more than the audio style show that i could tell but

[00:36:16] could be wrong but i think we all kind of seem to fill into whatever or you're comfortable with

[00:36:21] whatever we consume is what we like i feel if you're a if you like barbecue you probably

[00:36:26] would cook barbecue yeah you know it's kind of the way things go so basically the one thing i

[00:36:31] really heard about podcast in 2.0 was that it's all about this value for value thing where you can

[00:36:37] give cash directly to the content creators instantly through the app it's always been through

[00:36:41] like some kind of bitcoin cryptocurrency kind of thing and i'm not a big fan of cryptocurrency

[00:36:45] i like called hard cash american dollars you know that's why i'm running on really but

[00:36:52] well they're ever evolved regular money with through a value for value there are some difficulties

[00:36:58] with that because in order to process payments at least right now in the industry the general

[00:37:05] industry standard is that there's not only a percentage rate of a fee taken from any

[00:37:10] transferred payment but there's also often a per transaction fee like you like it paypal and

[00:37:18] their fee is something like 2.9% plus 49 cents so if someone wanted to send you 50 cents through

[00:37:27] paypal well you can't really do that paypal is going to eat all of that and that's the idea

[00:37:33] of micro payments and that's where some of this stuff with streaming satoshis which is a very

[00:37:39] small portion of bitcoin comes in where you don't have those per transaction fees and what i really

[00:37:47] love to see is what i've predicted will happen in podcast now i think we've seen this happen multiple

[00:37:54] times through the different stages of podcasts and podcasting is that the technology will disappear

[00:38:02] so even if we are using cryptocurrency to enable people to send payments to each other

[00:38:09] through podcasting and app store to automatically stream a certain amount of money for every minute

[00:38:13] of your podcast that i listen to or things like that that it might use cryptocurrency on the back end

[00:38:19] but neither you nor the audience have to care about that maybe you just know it as a i've bought

[00:38:27] 1000 tokens for five dollars i can send these tokens to whatever podcast i listen to then those

[00:38:34] podcasters can redeem those tokens back to dollars and let's talk with those tokens like you are

[00:38:40] arcade or something like that right but they could then redeem that back to dollars

[00:38:45] at whatever the current rate is and who cares what those tokens actually are it's just a method

[00:38:52] of getting money from one place to another maybe the industry will change so that those processing fees

[00:38:58] will make those micro transactions easier and what i mean by micro transactions we could actually

[00:39:04] almost call mano transactions because sometimes it might be a couple of pennies per minute

[00:39:11] and that might not sound like much but it's actually a lot more valuable than

[00:39:18] podcast advertiser might be right right yeah i just the whole bit coin in the whole

[00:39:25] cryptocurrency thing it sounds very confusing i think for most people which is probably a lot of

[00:39:30] people have a doctor to it and if you try to throw that into podcast in 2.0 and if most people see

[00:39:36] that being the only thing it's associated with the podcast in 2.0 like what i'm not for really

[00:39:42] that i don't need that you know like it's a big waste of time especially when you get their players

[00:39:46] like patreon and buy me a coffee and probably other ones i don't know about that are out there too

[00:39:51] they kind of do some of the value for value on at least a surface level when you get to go through

[00:39:55] their app and their their thing but at the end of the day you're still giving money to your

[00:40:00] to the creator yeah and the goal here is to really integrate all of this into the podcast to

[00:40:07] have itself like you think of patreon or buy me a cough here anything like that first i think

[00:40:11] a lot of podcasters are making a mistake of speaking those brand names to their audience and thus

[00:40:18] forever tying them to that brand name or if they ever change in the future invalidating their

[00:40:23] past calls to action so i really recommend podcasters if you use patreon by me a coffee

[00:40:29] anything like that never speak that brand name instead send your audience to a page or redirect

[00:40:35] on your domain like a slash support or slash give back or gift or whatever something on your

[00:40:41] domain that you can then redirect or make a page yourself or anything like that so all your past

[00:40:46] calls to action can remain valid even a few switch tools in the future but beyond that that is a

[00:40:53] tool that is outside of the podcast app if i want to support a podcast on patreon i am leaving the

[00:40:58] cast app to do that and then if that patreon feed gives me something exclusive by supporting it

[00:41:06] i have to do a bunch of extra things in order to get that extra content into my podcast app

[00:41:13] whereas the vision of podcasting 2.0 is to keep all of this inside the podcasting app so that

[00:41:20] people who want to support the podcast can do that in the podcast app and if that somehow unlocks

[00:41:27] some kind of bonus content it can do that in the podcast app without they're having to do all

[00:41:34] kinds of other things or switch to other websites or switch to a different podcast app but it's

[00:41:40] all right there inside the app now does every podcast app have these capabilities rolling certain

[00:41:47] few of them do they don't all have it yet and there are some like Spotify who do not like

[00:41:55] podcasting standards and we're probably never support even the simplest features of podcasting 2.0

[00:42:01] some of these features like when it comes to the cryptocurrency stuff which is only one tiny aspect

[00:42:07] of this bigger idea that we call value for value but some app developers and companies are never

[00:42:12] going to touch the cryptocurrency stuff but we have seen apple you know apple podcast one of the

[00:42:21] pop stuff in the podcasting yeah they now support the podcasting 2.0 transcript feature and I am

[00:42:30] very hopeful that now that they support that that will inspire other apps to not only support that

[00:42:37] same feature but to also realize oh there are all these other features I could easily start supporting

[00:42:44] in my app as long as I'm building in support for this one podcasting 2.0 feature I could start supporting

[00:42:51] some of these others too so I'm hopeful that it will start creating an avalanche of apps

[00:42:57] supporting these new features and the more apps and podcasts that support these features and

[00:43:03] start demanding support for these features from the audiences and the podcasters.

[00:43:09] The more those popular apps will start to support them too like you look at apple many years ago

[00:43:15] when serial first came out there was no true crime category inside apple podcasts but then

[00:43:22] serial made this explosion of true crime podcasts so much so that there was a demand for a whole

[00:43:29] category about true crime and then apple added a true crime category and some of these other things

[00:43:36] too like how to handle a serialized podcast where you have to listen in a particular order

[00:43:42] how to add episode numbers and some of these other things have come about as a result of the

[00:43:48] need for them. Yeah well with this all this podcasting 2.0 stuff well the app have to get

[00:43:54] so like an app handle like everything you're talking about or just have to like just become a

[00:44:01] whole new app they can handle it because a lot of these things are simply an additional field in the

[00:44:12] transcripts are a little bit more difficult because it means downloading the separate file and then

[00:44:17] lining that up with audio but that's fairly easy for an app to do like a transcript

[00:44:22] in this way that we do it in podcasting 2.0 is not simply a text document with a huge block of text

[00:44:30] it is time stamped and some transcripts can even be timestamped down to the word but most of

[00:44:42] our show with closed captions on you're not seeing a giant paragraph you're seeing just

[00:44:48] phrase by phrase at a time as it's being spoken that's how a transcript works because of the

[00:44:53] machine readable format of it has these timestamps to know when it gets to 1 minute and 3 seconds

[00:44:59] in the audio show this line at 1 minute and 3 seconds until 1 minute and 9 seconds then show this

[00:45:07] so the apps can handle that fairly easily and some of these features are simple as just

[00:45:13] exposing the information some of them take a little bit more work but the nice thing is

[00:45:19] what this can mean for the app developers is it can mean a better app a better experience for the

[00:45:27] audience like take another example the person tag as we call it where you can indicate who is in your

[00:45:34] podcast not just the author tag where you're simply writing the names and that's it but the

[00:45:40] person tag can contain extra data like the picture of the person their name a link that confirms

[00:45:47] their identity something like that so a little bit of data and then what a podcast app can do

[00:45:53] is then when you tap on that person's name you instantly see all the other podcasts that they

[00:46:00] or all the other podcast episodes they've been a guest on because those other episodes

[00:46:05] have added that same data to that tag and the apps can make that really easily to expose that

[00:46:12] so like if you're a big fan of herson forward and you want to see all the episodes he's ever been

[00:46:18] on then you could tap on his name and then suddenly see all of that information as it's populated

[00:46:24] and that is what the back end data is making possible to expose to the apps so the apps then

[00:46:31] get a better experience for the consumers. Fantastic man that sounds like a lot and going back to

[00:46:40] the transcripts really quick here I was going to ask you is does the transcript itself an apple podcast

[00:46:45] get searched in the search field at all does any that data get put in there like if you typed

[00:46:50] something you said it'll pull it up and that one podcast it does now work it's for while it was

[00:46:57] only the top podcast we're getting automated transcripts but Apple recently announced that all

[00:47:02] podcasts would get automatic transcripts but there is a way that you can upload your own through using

[00:47:08] the podcast in 2.0 transcript feature an apple will index those and that is I think a great way to address

[00:47:18] this search issue that Apple over the years has changed certain things and like for example

[00:47:26] for I think maybe almost forever you could not actually find a podcast by words that were in

[00:47:32] its description. You could always find podcasts and almost every app by words that are in the podcast

[00:47:38] title most of the apps support the episode titles most of the apps support the author or the

[00:47:44] artist tag like who hosts the podcast so if you search for Daniel J Lewis you would find my podcast

[00:47:50] right but not many apps support the description of the episode and part of the reason for that is

[00:47:57] there are some people out there who start manipulating things and putting in thoughts that

[00:48:03] yeah no way people would try and cheat the system it would have ever you'd imagine but people do

[00:48:09] like an example of this if you just search any podcast app for Zig Ziglar is dead then you will

[00:48:17] find a lot of podcasts trying to capitalize on his name when maybe they've never interviewed him

[00:48:24] and maybe they never even talk about his content well same thing with Taylor Swift too I mean

[00:48:30] yeah that I mentioned Taylor Swift about Swift he's all hit this podcast up I think so we'll get the big

[00:48:36] time is classy money now yeah so you mentioned both it's double whammy he gets double we actually

[00:48:41] did that out of the christ christian show we did an episode about Taylor Swift's new song or video

[00:48:45] years and years ago and that episode did do fairly well I thought I think about it it was in the

[00:48:50] title like you know so I think that's what I'm gonna do with it so shifting gears your Daniel

[00:48:55] your new project you're working on is pod gaugement now what is pod gaugement and what does it do

[00:49:02] I am passionate about helping podcasters engage their audiences and grow their podcasts

[00:49:08] because I think from most podcasters if you were to ask them what is the most fun thing about pod

[00:49:14] casting they would probably say oh man it is engaging with my community it's hearing back from the

[00:49:21] audience getting to talk to these people getting to see the change that I'm making in their lives

[00:49:26] things like that that's where the real profit is coming from for many of these podcasters

[00:49:32] and at its core that is engagement with their audience and so pod gaugement coming from it's

[00:49:40] another port mantow it is podcast engagement do I have the apple apples coming for you

[00:49:46] pod gaugement then builds on that and helps podcasters to engage their audiences through ratings and

[00:49:54] reviews through receiving feedback through networking with other podcasters through collecting reviews

[00:49:59] directly from their audience from searching for reviews and ratings and nearly 200 places doing

[00:50:06] all of these things as ways to collect that engagement for podcasters so that they can use

[00:50:12] that in their podcast maybe they read that feedback in their podcast maybe they even play voice

[00:50:19] males from their audience in their podcast that's something that pod gaugement offers

[00:50:23] that is my favorite feature is the ability to collect voice males from people you send them to a landing

[00:50:30] or eventually embed something on your website and your audience could record a voice message for you

[00:50:35] so it's not always your voice in your podcast but some of your audiences voice in your podcast

[00:50:41] responding to things that you said sharing feedback for you sharing theories pointing something

[00:50:47] out asking a question anything like that that starts to get really exciting and here's the real

[00:50:53] power in that that a lot of people don't realize when you can directly engage your audience and this

[00:51:00] by the way is something that we indie podcasters can do better than anyone else because we're not

[00:51:08] big time podcasters we don't have a huge team we're not locked in an office where we record the audio

[00:51:14] and then leave and touch the podcas never after that we're deeply connected with our content

[00:51:19] and we can deeply connect with our audience by engaging with them and when you do that

[00:51:26] you turn the audience member that you've engaged with you're turning them into a super fan

[00:51:34] so if they want to be there yeah they will be more likely to stick around on your podcast

[00:51:39] more likely to stand up for you and what can really help you grow is more likely to promote your

[00:51:47] podcast other people because it still happens today you know the whole mom I'm on the radio I'm on the

[00:51:54] TV that same kind of thing happens with podcasts too of hey you got to listen to this they

[00:52:00] played my feedback that's my voice you hear on there or they're answering my question they use

[00:52:05] my theory they talked about my idea on their podcast and they start telling other people and they say

[00:52:11] you got to listen to this here listen see right here this is where they listen that's my voice

[00:52:16] that's my voice there in the podcast that that's this celebrity I follow you know celebrity to them

[00:52:22] you're turning them into evangelists for your podcast by engaging them by including them

[00:52:29] and that is so powerful because the number one way we've said this for years and recent surveys

[00:52:35] have confirmed this with actual data that top way people discover podcasts

[00:52:43] is recommendations from people they trust whether that's friends or yeah I guess they listen to

[00:52:48] that is so true I also heard another fun fact is that podcasting is usually not there's no

[00:52:55] algorithms pushing out podcast people don't tell us and usually on the apps anyways

[00:53:00] well versus like YouTube there's lots of algorithms YouTube and Instagram that things like that

[00:53:04] Facebook it's all algorithm based I guess what it's speaking podcasting Lisa that's core with the

[00:53:09] apps that we have today usually are not that so pod gauge but the thing I find fascinating about

[00:53:15] it is that you said that you will pull review that was this review is but rankings there's a lot

[00:53:21] of different rankings systems out there when you pull all of them together yeah I pull all of those

[00:53:25] now right now although I am tracking some of the ratings the rankings and charts I'm not yet

[00:53:31] displaying that by pinpointing that data for years it's just deciding how to display years worth

[00:53:37] literally more than a terabyte of data to write and there's a lot of different places that

[00:53:42] rank things differently I think you know so I don't know which ones you would use as the Apple ones but

[00:53:47] even with an Apple there's like different countries they've all got their their own I don't know

[00:53:50] having access that stuff play truth but what that's the other thing yeah yeah with you think about

[00:53:56] you might be in the United States and you have listeners in the United States and in Canada

[00:54:03] but in order to see those reviews if they leave a rating or review in the Canadian store that is

[00:54:10] not displayed in your US listing in Apple podcast so on your iPhone if you look at Apple podcasts you

[00:54:16] will see only the ratings and reviews that were left in your country's store through the podcast

[00:54:23] connect system which is probably how you submitted your podcast to Apple it is now possible to

[00:54:28] go in and switch between the different countries but Chris there are 175 different countries to switch

[00:54:35] to and you have no idea even which ones have ratings or reviews let alone if they are new

[00:54:44] so it would take you 1400 clicks I counted this one time what's happening on time for this

[00:54:51] yeah every day to do what I made pod engagement to do for podcasters automatically to check nearly

[00:54:58] 200 places for ratings and reviews collect those all in a single place for you emailing you

[00:55:05] notifications if you want or sending them through Slack or other integrations like that so that

[00:55:10] you can stay on top of these reviews think the people who gave you ratings and reviews and again by

[00:55:16] thanking them naming them maybe even reading an excerpt of the review in that alone inspires more

[00:55:22] people to give you more ratings and reviews which gives you more feedback it doesn't help you in

[00:55:27] algorithms and you know there's a popular myth out there that ratings and reviews help you

[00:55:31] rank better that's not true but ratings and reviews are social proof and they're basically

[00:55:36] testimonials giving you power to better promote your podcast and give you ideas of ways that you can

[00:55:43] improve your podcast and better reach your audience so they do help you to grow your own podcast they

[00:55:50] won't grow your podcast for you but you can use them so pod engagement saves you all this time

[00:55:55] from having to go and check these places or copying paste or embed these things or screenshot

[00:56:01] these things for you pod engagement does that for you even now makes images like if you got a

[00:56:06] review you really like and maybe it's a long review so you can't fit it into a single post somewhere

[00:56:11] you could export an image maybe a wide image tall image maybe for Pinterest square image for

[00:56:16] Instagram you can do that to better engage your audience show off your engagement that you have

[00:56:23] show off some of your audience members and their feedback and their experiences and again

[00:56:27] turning them into super fans nice man so with the pod engagement when you do the reviews and

[00:56:36] everything you package it all together can make like a little cute little like media board

[00:56:40] everybody call it a media what do you call the thing where they get I can't think of it where you have

[00:56:44] all your stuff in one package to like a media kit media kit yeah sorry I'm like yes media

[00:56:49] like a nice little media kit showing off your podcast can you create that or does it do

[00:56:53] it for you it doesn't do it for you yet but that is actually on my list to do that kind of thing

[00:56:58] because one of the things I'm working on in the future there's so much I'm excited about doing

[00:57:03] because a little brief tangent here the product for nine years was called my podcast reviews

[00:57:10] and that was very limited to well podcast reviews it's right there in the title

[00:57:17] and I wanted to do so much more with the product so I rebuilt it from the ground up

[00:57:22] gave it a new name pod engagement so it focuses more on engagement and already have launched

[00:57:28] a whole bunch of new features with it since it's almost a year now of the rebrand and it has all

[00:57:34] kinds of new features and that media kit idea is one of those things that I'll be able to in the

[00:57:39] near future pull in some of the stats from your podcast hosting provider certain ones being supported

[00:57:45] that is and be able to build a media kit for you I think you could say I want this media kit to

[00:57:53] always automatically display my most impressive numbers my four and five star ratings and reviews

[00:58:02] and how many countries my podcast is consumed in and some of my top feedback or maybe it's

[00:58:08] something like in the interface you can tag some of your ratings and reviews and feedback as those

[00:58:13] are your favorites so maybe it's whenever you get a new one that you really like you tag it

[00:58:18] and it automatically gets inserted into your media kit and you could download as that as a PDF or

[00:58:24] maybe send people to a page that would be designed and branded for your podcast where it has

[00:58:29] that always up to date information that's coming that's not available yet definitely coming because

[00:58:34] as you can tell I put a lot of thought into building this feature and what I want it to do for pod

[00:58:40] that would be the one thing I would be really interested in because if you go through all the

[00:58:44] reviews maybe you got other views or whatever you can't have found the right one it looks great

[00:58:48] it looks great but they have to like organize it on like PDF page or some kind of something

[00:58:53] rather make it look pretty and change or choose right fonts and choose right colors in the

[00:58:57] background and choose the right whatever all of stuff make it look presentable at all that's

[00:59:01] a lot of work and if you can create something that appoles all that together something that's

[00:59:07] all done ready to go that you can show off to potentially maybe new clients or new listeners

[00:59:11] or maybe even guests that you want to you know to get on your show you can you could even do

[00:59:16] that now what you do with things speaking of guests we have like in the media kit have like

[00:59:21] I've interviewed this person that person this person on the media kit too.

[00:59:25] I would love to add that kind of feature it might be harder to pull in automatically

[00:59:29] but there are some ways that that could be done well especially supporting podcasting 2.0

[00:59:35] features because I could look at your RSS feed and look at all of those occurrences of the

[00:59:40] person tag that are not you and your normal co-hosts and then automatically pull those in

[00:59:48] and maybe it could be the same thing where you see okay these are all of the past guests

[00:59:52] that I've interviewed and you tag certain ones as these are the favorites these are the ones

[00:59:57] I want to feature and those automatically go into your media kit as well. I love that idea thank

[01:00:02] you. Hey welcome may patent pending ice.

[01:00:05] But yeah I just think that like presentation with push-up podcasting since there's no algorithm

[01:00:10] really pushing our podcast show out to people it's kind of like word amount and lot of reviews

[01:00:15] and lot of different things and all this stuff kind of helps out and I think that having a good

[01:00:19] you know presentation a good package to kind of put in front of people because people say what your

[01:00:24] podcast about you kind of explain to them or whatever you maybe even give a business card or who

[01:00:27] knows what but based on that one little impression but if you had a whole package just put together

[01:00:31] very nicely and pull the things together like you said like the countries and the reviews

[01:00:37] all of them all together and nice little format that's easy to digest when you glance at it

[01:00:42] and it looks pretty easy for a podcast right put together I think a lot of us podcasters

[01:00:47] a lot of indie podcaststers they do the show they have fun doing it but it comes to all the

[01:00:52] hard gritty work like you're talking about like I don't have time for that stuff man

[01:00:56] and that's one of the ways that we talked earlier about how niche podcasters can

[01:01:00] better position themselves and do things that big people can't do what sets me apart from my competition

[01:01:06] now my podcast reviews my original product was the first service online service of its kind

[01:01:13] and since then there have been some direct copycats but some other people have launched similar

[01:01:18] services and stitching yes I now have competition with some of these different features

[01:01:23] but I'll tell you what separates me from these others and maybe your audience can already tell

[01:01:30] is I am passionate about podcasting and helping podcasters I am a podcaster first

[01:01:38] and so my perspective on helping podcasters comes from that background of I'm in the trenches

[01:01:45] with you I want these features too I use these features too I talk to other podcasters all the time

[01:01:52] who want and use these features and I listen to their ideas and I try to build things for them

[01:01:58] also there's some balance of this thinking kind of like the Henry Ford quotation of

[01:02:04] if I ask people what they wanted they would have asked for a faster horse but instead he gave them a car

[01:02:09] that kind of thing I can also listen to some of that because I've worked with people

[01:02:13] I also have a design background by the way graphic design and things and I've worked with people who

[01:02:18] would say things like can you make that text red and I love that example because when they ask

[01:02:25] can you make it red my first response I just outright want to say to them sometimes no I'm not

[01:02:31] going to make it red but I try to approach it differently and kindly I say you want that to stand out

[01:02:37] don't you that's why they want it red so it's not really they want it red they want it to stand out

[01:02:45] so what are ways that I can make it stand out instead of making it red or is making it red

[01:02:51] actually the best way to make it stand out so it's certain things like that thinking what is it that

[01:02:58] the podcast or actually needs or what can serve their needs better those are the kinds of things

[01:03:04] that I think sent me apart and that I get excited about supporting podcasts there's was most of my

[01:03:11] other competitors are business people first data people first advertisers first they're focused on

[01:03:17] some of those things and maybe they didn't even or maybe never have had their own podcast before

[01:03:24] but I've been in the trenches and I have the actual earned experience of a podcaster and I also

[01:03:30] have design background and some of the stuff that helps me to better make these things for podcasters

[01:03:35] like when I launch this image maker feature for making not only images from your individual

[01:03:42] reviews but also attractive promotional images for your podcast so like you could have the cover art

[01:03:49] for your podcast that title of your podcast your name on it and also it could say how many

[01:03:55] ratings in total that you have so you can show off just with a simple image that your podcast has

[01:04:01] a hundred ratings and it's an average five star rating for your podcast you could show that

[01:04:06] often it is designed in a beautiful way so that you don't have to think about that because

[01:04:12] as Richard already said ain't nobody got time for that that's right man but because

[01:04:17] most of the podcasters are working you know one maybe sometimes two jobs and then a podcast

[01:04:21] so it's you know I mean we don't got time to big budgets like the big guys do to spend money on

[01:04:28] marketing you guys handle all talk you guys handle the rest you know gotta think right so

[01:04:32] I know a lot of I think a lot of youtubers do the same thing too I just watch some YouTube

[01:04:36] shows like I'm like there's no way they edit their show there's no way they just do their

[01:04:39] thing and record they do all their stuff but there's no way they're doing the editing on the

[01:04:42] stuff somebody else is doing that now not that that that far along yet but someday love the dream you know

[01:04:49] oh yeah yeah it is nice to hand off that responsibility but yeah most of us are doing these

[01:04:54] things ourselves and sometimes we don't have the time sometimes we don't have the skills

[01:05:00] to do some of these things ourselves and that's especially I think a lot of podcasters don't

[01:05:05] have design skills to make certain things look good and that's not a fault of their own oftentimes

[01:05:13] I don't think they should need to know these things just like when it comes to podcasting

[01:05:18] 2.0 I really think podcasters should not need to know the actual code that makes it possible in

[01:05:25] RSS tags and some of that technical stuff they just need to be able to see here's a field

[01:05:31] fill in this information and it will do these really cool things in this magic inside the

[01:05:36] podcast apps or like on pod engagement you click these couple toggles you fill in this

[01:05:41] information and it gives you this beautiful image for your podcast exactly well Daniel this has been

[01:05:48] so fantastic I mean you stopped by today man I really really appreciate you give me your time today man

[01:05:53] so where can everybody find out all about you and all your wonderful stuff and pod engagement

[01:05:59] if you want to listen to my podcast about podcasting I've got hundreds of episodes out there right now

[01:06:05] currently on hiatus because I am also a full-time single dad home schooling my son while running a

[01:06:11] business so the podcast is when I can publish it but the podcast is available at the audacity to

[01:06:18] podcast.com and for pod engagement I've invited Chris to my pod engagement affiliate program so what I'm

[01:06:26] going to say is look at the notes for this episode and click on his link that will take you to

[01:06:33] podgagement.com but click on his link so that he can earn a commission from referring you to

[01:06:38] podgagement if you want to sign up and if you just want to connect with me I'm on most social

[01:06:43] accounts as the Daniel J Lewis. The Daniel J Lewis what is the J stands for by the way Joseph Joseph okay

[01:06:51] all right making sure it's so cool what someone's got like a metal initial is a part of their

[01:06:56] official name you know that Michael J Fox or whatever you know so that's pretty cool Daniel thank you so much

[01:07:02] you're coming by today I really appreciate you stopping by Chris it was so great to talk with you thank you

[01:07:07] wow that was fantastic so great we learned so many cool new things about indie podcasting podcasting 2.0 and of

[01:07:17] course all about the cool new pod engagement and if you want to use pod engagement you can use my

[01:07:23] affiliate link which will be down below in the show notes of this very episode and probably every

[01:07:29] single episode from here on out my affiliate link will be right down there to pod engagement if you want

[01:07:35] involved you want to learn more about your pod gas and you want to be able to utilize every tool

[01:07:42] available with the pod casting community when it comes to reviews and all of that wonderful stuff

[01:07:48] get it all put into one place where you can track all this stuff all you want for your hearts

[01:07:53] content check out pod engagement and you keep on making your amazing pod gas and until next time happy pod

[01:08:01] casting